Episode 18 - A Conversation with Dr. Paulina

This episode features Dr. Paulina Cossette! On this episode, Dr. Paulina shares about her experience of leaving the world of academia and professorship. Additionally, she shares about her journey of becoming a freelancer and small business owner and entering into the world of copy editing.

To connect with Dr. Paulina Cossette, please feel free to check out her website, connect with her via her social media platforms, and/or reach out to her via email:

Website: acadiaediting.com

Instagram: acadiaediting

Facebook: acadiaeditingservices

YouTube: acadiaediting

Email: paulina@acadiaediting.com

Listen to full episode :

Here is a transcription of Episode 18:

0:17: Hello and welcome to the Broke PhD Podcast, where we build relationships or kindle emotions with every episode! I'm your host, Dr. G!

0:26: On this episode, I talk with Dr. Paulina Cossette who shares her experience of leaving the world of academia and professorship and embarking on the journey of being a freelancer and small business owner and entering into the world of copy editing.

0:41: [Dr. G] Hello Doctor Paulina, would you please just share a little bit about yourself for the listeners?

0:47: [Dr. Paulina] Sure! So I'm Paulina Cossette and I'm originally from Florida. I now live in Maine. I used to be a political science professor, but I left teaching in 2019. And after applying to several non-academic jobs and kept getting rejected, told I was overqualified, I decided to try copy editing. And that was about four years ago and I've since developed academic copy editing business called Acadia Editing Services and just this, last summer, I've started coaching faculty who would like to leave academia and become editors.

1:25: [Dr G] Ohh, I love that so much! Can you, because I know we talked about this the first time we've talked on Zoom. Can you just share about your transition a little bit out of academia and into the world of copy editing?

1:35: [Dr. Paulina] Yeah. So, you know, when I was in grad school, I loved it! I loved my PhD program! I had a fantastic advisor! I felt like having been like a nerdy band kid, you know, I was in marching band and jazz band in high school and like, grad school for me was the place where I finally found my people. You know, the other nerds and I, some of my best friends, I met in grad school and it was a great experience. But then you know, you get funneled into the academic job market and put on the, the plan of the tenure track. And it's like, you know, initially when I went in, I didn't want to be a professor. I wanted to go into research, but there's so much pressure from your advisors and your mentors that, ohh, well, you're supposed to get a tenure track job. That's just what you do. That I, you know, I, I caved to it and I thought, well, they, they know what they're talking about, so I should go ahead and do it. And I did. I had two different tenure track jobs when I was teaching, but, well, the first one, at least before I took it, I knew I wasn't going to be happy there. I knew I didn't like the city. I knew I didn't like the school. And all my advisors said just go for a few years and you can go on the market again and do something else. And so again, I trusted them. But, you know, long story short, academia is really hard. You know, like you think a PhD program is hard, but it gets worse, you know. And, and many people love it. And if they do, that's fantastic. You know, you should do, ultimately you should do what you love, but you should know going into an academic job that it's really hard work. The expectations are climbing every year. You know, I taught at liberal arts colleges where it wasn't like there was, there was a strong focus on teaching and mentoring, but you also had to do research, you know, the, the standards for getting tenure were getting higher and higher in terms of research and having a book and all that stuff. And so it's like you're expected to do everything. And at least when I had my son, that left me working seven days a week and on no sleep because I had a new baby. And so, you know, it just, it wasn't healthy. It wasn't fun, it wasn't healthy. It was, I had a lot of challenges with students and behavior issues and academic dishonesty and, and I just couldn't do it, you know, and I think I know so many people are in that situation. Whether they're grad students who are dealing with advisors who are abusive or whether they're faculty and they're just overworked and underpaid. It's a really tough situation to be in.

4:10: [Dr. G] Thank you for your transparency and for sharing about your experience, and I'm truly sorry you've had to endure that. And coming from that experience, I'm curious, how did you, kind of find the the field of copy editing?

4:24: [Dr. Paulina] So I, as I was wrapping up in academia and I should say that I was planning to teach in the fall. This is in the summer of 2019. You know, I was scheduled to teach, but June came around, July, and I just was in this incredible turmoil of I can't do this, you know, like I, I was so anxious and had so much guilt about the thought of leaving my department colleagues in the lurch and them having to find somebody to replace me on short notice. But I also knew that if I went back, it was going to be a really bad situation. And I was just going to be miserable. And I, you know, I had to leave. And so we were living in Maryland at the time, my husband and I and our son and so we packed up our bags and we moved back to Maine, where my husband grew up. And I, you know, like I said, I, I went on the market and was looking for non-academic jobs, remote jobs locally, there's not much. Because we're in rural Maine. And so I had just published my book, and we had worked with a freelance copy editor who worked for the publisher. And I thought I could do that, you know, that that wouldn't be so hard. I know how to do this. I'm a really good writer. Yeah, all my professors always told me I was a great writer. I'm a stickler for proofreading and grammar. This can't be that hard, like I'll do this until I get a real job. And so I did it. You know, I had to bring money in. We couldn't be just on one salary and you, you do what you gotta do. And then it turned out that I loved it! You know, I loved freelancing. I was scared to label myself as a business owner because that sounded intimidating. You know, like I can't own a business. So I was a freelancer at first for different companies, and then it was just amazing, you know, like I got to read all this research before it was published. I worked for several academic book publishers. You know, I said that before I'm a nerd, right? Who doesn't want to sit at their desk all day reading academic books that are just fascinating before everybody else gets to read them? And so it was fun. And then I, I ended up, you know, learning the ropes. It took me a while because there's not really a lot of help out there, you know, learning how to build the business side of an academic editing business. And now I'm to the point where I'm just working with private clients. So just grad students and faculty on their articles, books, job market materials, pretty much anything that they need help with. And then of course, I have a new course where I'm coaching faculty on how to do the same thing.

6:51: [Dr. G] Ohh, I love this! Thank you for sharing your story and thank you for sharing this insight of where your journey from where it started to now. And I think this is something that we had also talked about before in our first meeting, is that everyone is kind of fed the same kool-aid of when you jump into the world of academia, especially if you're going for a PhD, that OK, afterwards you need to go and become faculty member and you need to get tenure. Like that should be your goals. And it was just refreshing getting to talk to you and meet you virtually, of course, and seeing somebody else who's doing something outside of just that tenure track and who is like, hey, actually academia isn't for me. And so having that be another person that exists in the world, so to speak, that's not doing academia, even though you know, initially it was something like you wanted to do research, I can connect with that because that's what I want to do. And again, I love research and I love nerding out about different facts and methodology in research. But jumping into the world of academia, it is a lot. And just seeing what my professors were going through, what my colleagues were going through, who were going into the professorship, just it was not something that was appealing for me either. And so I appreciate you sharing and just giving your thoughts of like, hey there, there's other things you can do outside of just walking into the world of professorship and copy editing was something that I had not heard about. So I am so glad that you are sharing about this and I want you to just take a moment to also talk about your business and where you're hopefully planning to take it and the direction you want to go in the future.

8:19: [Dr. Paulina] Yeah. Well, so like I said, I started out freelancing. So basically there are companies out there, whether they're academic book publishers like Rutledge or University Presses, and they have people who are called in-house copy editors who are, you know, salaried positions that they work for the publisher or the company and they read the books and the documents and they do the, you know, the proofreading and the grammar correction and all that. But the companies have so much work that they contract out a lot of it to freelancers like me. And so I found that getting started that way was sort of like on the job training. You know, there are editing programs out there at different universities where you can take their courses for several thousand dollars and get an editing certificate. But you know, as an academic, and I tell this to my faculty enrolled in my course who I coach, you know what scholarship is supposed to look like, right? Just going through Graduate School, even if you're a Grad student still or you've recently graduated and you haven't had an academic position yet. You've read enough articles and academic books to know what this is supposed to look like. And if you're a strong writer and you know, like I said, you like to catch those typos and stuff, you don't really need that kind of training, you know, as as if you were somebody who didn't have that academic background then yes, it would be helpful, but I think that going the route of freelancing to start out is a great way to do that on the job training. And so then a few years later, I started taking on private clients and so connecting with faculty and, you know, grad students who are going through the dissertation process know how difficult it is to format the dissertation with and make the table of contents and all that. So that's the kind of thing that I do with grad students. And so I, I was just been working with those kinds of folks, the private clients mainly. And it lets you stay connected to academia. You know, you not only are you reading the research, but you get to know these clients over and over, you know, they hire you for different projects. Somebody might hire me for their job market materials and then later they're working on their book. And so they need help with that. And so you sort of get to know them overtime. And so it's nice to have those kinds of relationships as well. But to your earlier point about you don't have to just go the tenure track that's so true and I, you know, I feel bad for the students who are in departments where they are still trying to channel you in that direction, you know, to force you into that box because nowadays with and and maybe this is like a post COVID thing that people are really opening their eyes to all the remote jobs that are out there, but if you go on LinkedIn and you look up, you know, academic coach or something like that, you will see there are so many people who have left academia who are now they're writing coaches, right? You can work with them one-on-one or in Group coaching to try to be more productive as a scholar, you know, as in terms of finishing your articles or even your dissertation coach or you know, there's people who are publishing coaches who help you turn your dissertation into a book. There's people who are ADHD and executive function coaches, right? They work with grad students who have executive function challenges and need that help and that person who is a mentor who understands what their unique struggles are. And so the, the doors are just wide open, you know, and you're limited by just your creativity. And so for any folks out there, you know, if you feel like academia is challenging and maybe it's not right for you, I encourage you to go on LinkedIn and Instagram and find some of these people because you can really see what the different options are. And it's just so fun to work for yourself. You know, like why would you want to be an academia when you can be your own boss, right?

12:11: [Dr. G] Yes, I love that! And definitely you can create your own path and I think both of us are examples of that, that we're trying to do something, being small business owners and finding that, hey, you don't have to settle and just be complacent with being unhappy in academia. And again, there are some out there who are thriving in academia and I love that for them and kudos to y’all for being able to do that in especially in the field where like you said, things are getting tougher, things are getting more rigorous, there's more responsibilities being placed, especially on professors with research, with teaching, with service to the community. I know there's different elements when it comes to professorship. And yeah, that either sides of the coin, whether you stay in academia or whether you leave academia just make sure that you do your due diligence and research, us researchers saying that, and look for all the options and all the possibilities. So yeah, thank you for highlighting that too. And I wanted to have you have an opportunity to share about you're doing a course right now focus on copy editing. Can you please talk about that?

13:12: [Dr. Paulina]Yeah, so it's called - Becoming an Academic Editor - And you know, like I was saying, there are quite a few programs out there that you can get an editing certificate and they teach you the grammar and the proofreading and the sort of the, you know, sentence structure and you know all that, the writing side of things. But there are very few courses out there. That teach you how to build a business. And so what I saw through my struggles my few years of trying to figure this out how do I get to this you know the Holy Land of the private clients not just freelancing for somebody else is that there are so many editors who are really talented but they just don't know how to attract clients. And so I thought I've got to help these people, you know, I've got to especially something that is so close to my heart of being a miserable faculty member, you know, like it's really, I mean, it was a really traumatic experience. And I know so many other people who have their own stories and they just don't know how to leave, You know, they're exactly where I was five years ago and they're miserable and they hate life and they don't know what to do. So that's sort of how this course emerged and it's set up, it's a digital course, it's through Thinkific, the course platform online. There's videos showing you how to find editing jobs. You know, everything from mindset coaching of how do we leave academia, when is the right time? How can I get the courage to do it and feel good about it without feeling guilty? To you know, where do I look for jobs? How do I apply to jobs? How do I turn my 10 page CV into a one page resume focused on editing? I have templates on style guides and invoices and contracts and it's sort of like a everything you need, right a a kit starter kit of starting your own editing business. But again, the focus isn't on the grammar and the punctuation and all that it's on, you know, sort of this transforming your identity from being faculty to becoming a business owner and an editor. And also, you know, what are all the tools that, that go along with that? Because I was saying I, I never thought I'd be a business owner. When I was a kid, you know, I was a first generation college student. My mom watched boats for a living. We lived in one bedroom apartments. When I thought of somebody who was an entrepreneur or a business owner, it was like an old white guy who played golf, you know, and so that vision, I could never be that I thought, you know, I, that doesn't fit me. I could never be a business owner. It's too hard to own a business. And since I started this work, I've, you know, I've come in contact with many, particularly women entrepreneurs out there because many of these post academic coaches are women and I've realized that it doesn't matter who you are, you know, you can be a business owner no matter who you are or where you come from. Owning an editing business is not as complicated as like say starting a restaurant or something, right? When we think of starting a business, you think there's tons of startup costs and so much risk and you need loans and all this and you don't need any of that with, you know, starting an editing or a coaching business. So, yeah, so it's a primarily a digital course, but I think that the real value that we have is in this community that I've created and we meet once a week on Zoom for an hour for group coaching and the stories that I have heard from all of the people who have joined, you know, and also the progress that they've made. People are already getting hired at editing companies, right? They've, you know, we over the last several weeks we've worked together on the resumes, creating a website, and now they're starting to get hired and they're doing their first editing jobs and it's just been such a transformation from ohh, my gosh, I'm terrified I'm going to fail at this to I did it, I got hired, I'm an editor. You know, and like to see that over the span of seven weeks is just amazing. You know, it took me 4 years to get there, but to be able to take that knowledge and now to help other people do it and be successful a lot faster I think is really rewarding for me.

17:30: [Dr. G] Ohh I love that so much! And one of the quotes that I love that like my family has followed is “lift as you climb” and so just extending that hand back that when you get to a position you can help others because you may not have had that provided for you. You're doing it. You're a walking example of that, that through creating your course and through building this community around helping others develop their editing business, you are helping them be able to, you know, go on and do more with their life that they may not have dreamed of before because they were so kind of boxed in with, I can only do this one thing and be on this one path. And so I think that is so amazing. And so thank you for sharing that. But I love hearing those success stories of, like you said, in only seven weeks that people are getting hired and that you know what they've been working towards and it is scary to start a business and it is scary to go on a path that they would have, like you said, never dreamed of that you could start your own small business and you could do something outside of what has been fed to you the whole time. That seeing that success start to happen in real time is probably not only amazing for you, but also for them too, because they're going through it as well. So thank you for sharing that. As we're continuing our conversation, I wanna ask you, can you just share some takeaways or some insights with the listeners, whether they're in a college program or they're looking to get into an educational program or they have long finished their program years ago, but they might be looking to make a change in their life and pivot in their careers. Is there any takeaways or advice for them going through an educational program or life overall that you would like to share?

19:02: [Dr. Paulina] Yeah. You know, I remember as I was debating whether or not I should leave academia, and it was like, you know, when you have to make a life decision like that you’re consumed by it and the anxiety is just so intense and what do I do? Like it's it's all on your mind 24 hours a day. And I don't I wish I remember where I read this, but there there was some somebody said you have to think of this decision not as like, OK, I'm making a choice either I go left or right in the path and I'm there for the rest of my life. That's not the way it is. You're going to choose left or right right now and then a year from now you're going to choose left or right again and then a year from that. You know what I mean? Like you're in this decision do whether it's, you know, do I leave grad school, whether it's do I get a tenure track job, whether it, you know, do I go into industry? Like it's just one choice in this long series of choices that you're going to be making throughout your life. And I think especially if you're in your 20s and early 30s, you know, you, you sort of feel and you're told by your advisors that you have to make this decision and, you know, be a professor for the rest of your life. And it's absurd. You know, like other people outside of academia do different jobs and work for different companies and they move around the world and they, you know what they do whatever they want. And we're told in academia that you have to get this job and stay there till you die. And it's ridiculous, you know, if you're a grad student and you think you might want to go the tenure track, then do it, you know, and if you get there and you hate it, then leave. You know, like you're, you are not beholden in life to anybody except yourself. And so don't, don't feel like you're making this decision to then do it for the rest of your life. You know, just think about what you want to do for the next one to three years and then change if you don't like it.

21:01: [Dr. G] I love that! And I'm going to echo that, that you don't have to stay in something if you don't like it and that decisions that you make right now, again, like you said, it's one of a long line of decisions you're going to continuously make throughout your life. And that if you pick this path right now, it's not something that you may stay on forever. And you never know what you can encounter that could completely divert you to a whole nother path. So I'm going to echo that tenfold. So thank you for sharing that. Was there anything else that you want? To share with the listeners before we end our conversation.

21:33: [Dr. Paulina] No, I think just if you're if you're curious about academic editing and you want to learn more, you can go to my website and maybe we can link to that in the show notes. And I'm always happy to talk with people who are, you know, stressed out about the idea of leaving academia or if you're curious about editing e-mail me or you know schedule a call on my website. I'm happy to chat and and get in touch so.

21:57: [Dr. G] Perfect! And yes all of the contact information for Dr. Paulina will be in the description box below so please check that out if you're interested in reaching out to her about starting your own editing business or if you want to reach out and just talk to her about anything else that you were interested that you've heard in our conversation and just talk about maybe changing careers and diverting to another path. So, Dr. Paulina, I want to thank you so much for being on the show. And thank you for sharing your experience and your insight.

22:26: [Dr. Paulina] Thanks so much for having me! It's been a lot of fun!

22:29: Well, that concludes this episode. But I am so excited to have you on this journey with me. And I really hope you've enjoyed the conversation I had with Dr. Paulina Cossette, and I hope it gives you the listeners out there some additional insights and some takeaways to recognize that life is not always a linear path and that's OK. That what you are doing right now and the career you're in or what you're thinking about embarking on may not be the same thing that you are doing in 5 or 10 years from now. And that's OK. We don't always have to have everything figured out and everything planned out to a tee, but I hope everyone out there just enjoys their life journey and to always stay present and to always stay open minded to all of the wonderful opportunities that you may come across. Just like Dr. Paulina came across copy editing and now she's doing something she loves. So if you have enjoyed this conversation and you want to continue to listen and to hear more stories and more experiences than please check out the Broke PhD Podcast website at – brokephdpodcast.com – to continue to follow along. Wherever you are in your own journey, I want you to remember that – YOU GOT THIS! I'm your host, Dr. G, and I hope you have a wonderful day!